The Responsibility of Being a Trusted Voice in the Health and Wellness Space with Zora Benhamou

If your goal is to use podcasting as a way to generate sales and leads for your health or wellness business, you’re in the right place because that’s all we talk about here.

But, today’s guest has told me her podcast is now a major part of her business model and income, so she is living the dream. Zora Benhamou hosts the Hack My Age podcast, which helps empower women navigating the menopausal transition through biohacking techniques. And information from forward thinking experts.

In this episode, you’ll learn how she has handled the responsibility of being a trusted voice in the health and wellness space when people are looking to you for advice, the importance of building a community around your brand, and how Zora makes sure that the guests she brings on are delivering value to her audience.

I’m Joel Oliver, and this is Profits through Podcasting. Zora, welcome in.

Thank you.

Let’s start with a brief history of your business just so we have a, a framework and understanding of what your business is.

So it’s hack my age, but when and why did you start it?

Oh, I started it in about 2017, more or less with a website basically selling my time consulting. A health coach. was interested always in health and wellness, and I was helping women and men as well, mostly just lose weight. They want a better body composition. But I realized quickly that it was hard to accommodate everybody because you give ’em an hour of your time, but then there’s so much stuff in the backend to prepare and help these people, and then it’s a constant, constant. Sucks. Sucks your time out. So in the end, I, I realized, okay, let’s see if we can build some programs, build some programs through that on the website. That helped because then I was able to increase my prices and then still have a very low price point for people who just didn’t want all my attention. And then eventually I started the podcast in 2020. And then I was in the biohacking space for women as I’m a woman, I’m 54, and at the time I was about 50 and I said, okay, let’s let’s focus on females. And then I quickly switched over to the menopause space because my audience was asking for more menopause information and the podcast, it. It’s interesting, it really is. Takes time to grow. So it was a ba it was a side thing that I was doing in addition to try to pay the bills with other things and, and you know, still consulting and still still trying to sell programs and still doing all these things. , but I really enjoy talking to people and, and it was an easy thing for me to into my business.

And so, so yeah, we’ve been sort of in the menopause space just, you know, soon after I started the, the podcast.

And the podcast is also called Hack My Age. You’re up to over 250 episodes at this point, which is a, a great accomplishment. And a couple other things I want to touch on too, just so we know everything that you’ve done, you’ve also authored a couple of books, right? I.

Yes, that was part of the selling campaign. So we, I did all digital, digital books because at the time I, I wasn’t sure how to self publish, although I could probably easily do that right now. It did take a lot of time to put those books together, so I have a, a, a comprehensive guide and you know how to hack your age.

And then I have a cookbook, separate cookbook if people wanted to have just one or than the other. But yeah, that was an easy thing to, to throw on the website. It’s all, it’s digital. I’m a digital nomad pretty much so for, for a long time. And so it sort of fit into the business model.

When you had the idea say, to write those books, was it born out of a, a desire from your audience as well? Like you mentioned you went into the menopause space ’cause of demand. Was that similar with the books or you just thought I should do this?

No, that didn’t come out from demand. It was. idea. It was part of the program. To buy this. They had different packages. You could buy the book or you could buy the book. With my consultation, you could buy just the cookbook if you wanna know how to, so I, I wanted to give different price points, but it was, in the end, it was hard to sell.

I, because I didn’t have very much of an. Have a presence online. I didn’t have a podcast when I started it. I didn’t have much of a, a presence on social media, so, that didn’t go as well as I thought it would.

Okay, well the live and learn, right? That’s what entrepreneurship is all about.

Mm-hmm.

before we move on to, I think there’s one last thing, maybe, maybe there’s more, but I think at least one, the actual community that you’ve built. Within your business, the, the biohacking menopause. Could you talk a bit about what that is?

So the community is another way to, to get residual income and. was recommended to me because again, you are, you wanna help people and you wanna get in touch with them. And then you build this Facebook group, which that was also part of my business and still is an Instagram group. And then, and then you get, you get bigger and bigger and then you, you, you wanna give time, but you just can’t,

Mm.

are limited, at least in my space, limited by what, what you can say and what you can do by meta.

For example, if I talked about vaginal health, it was like I suddenly got. Blocked and restricted because I used the word vagina or it was like, but this is about your health. And so I, I got very frustrated with, and it’s, and it’s still there. I just know I have to be careful with the things I say and the things that I post. , but when you have a community, you’re free. You’re free to say what you want and do what you want, and your community wants that information. And then the community is you know, you have more or less. Certain amount of money coming in each month because you have, you start like with a, with a base, your, your first fans in the beginning, and then you just keep growing and expanding it.

And the goal is to, to try to get more and more, because what you do is, is you get women together, or at least in my case, women, well, men or women. And then you’re able to. Give information, give webinars. We have live q and as you can have giveaways, you can have them motivated. It’s, again, a community very similar to like you’d have on Facebook or any other area.

People can comment and share and posts and we use Zoom to, to meet up and it’s very satisfying. I, I really enjoy my community , and the women that I attract because they’re all tend to be like-minded. then you have that freedom. And then just knowing that, okay, I’ll just have to keep building this.

This community and, and then knowing that every month I have X amount. And then if you keep growing it, there’s nothing more that you need to do. You just need to get more people. You don’t have to do more work because the work is is pretty much the same.

Yeah. There’s a lot of value in a community like that because there are many people out there, whatever their issue is or whatever they’re working on, or whoever they want to connect with. That’s could be a struggle. How do I connect with these people who are out there in the world? So then you have people like yourself who are putting your, your vibe out into the world and attracting back people who are similar to you.

And then you put those people all in a group and you’ve given them tremendous value just with that alone. And you know, the friendships and connections that they can make within a group like that. So,

thing that, that would be useful for anyone who is doing podcasting and wants to build a community, and by the way, my community isn’t so big that I don’t have the issue. So I think if you do, once you do grow, you probably need to buy, get or hire managers for the community.

’cause then, you know, you do wanna make sure everybody is, is really good in there. But, but one thing that’s really great is a. Podcast host at, at least in my situation, is that I invite all the guests to speak to my community like a, a free live q and a. It’s a bonus for them because they tap into a really well curated community and targeted audience. And so if they’re selling a book or. Product or program, or just wanna reach more women to share their information. It’s really a wonderful space for them, and it again, gives me content that I don’t need to really work on. I just have to moderate, you know, get the guests to come in and they talk and it’s, and it’s great to see the interaction and the community appreciates it because. My guess. I mean, if you were to hire them as a doctor, they would cost hundreds if not thousands of dollars for their time. Of course, it’s not a one-on-one consult, it’s really valuable for these people to be able to ask their own questions.

Mm-hmm.

do is I, with the community, I tell them, listen to the podcast first if you can, so that at least you, you’re tuned in, you’re dialed into this technique or therapy or book or whatever it is that they’re talking about.

And then. You don’t waste our time answering questions that they already asked. I asked in the podcast. So, so that way they are up to speed. And then once you listen, I mean, how many times have you listened to a podcast and said, oh, I still have questions, right? I, I wanna get in there. So I think a community for any podcast host who has guests, at least regular guests, a nice little bonus to have.

Yeah, that’s very interesting because not only are you giving more value to your community, but like you said, the guests that you’re having on, that’s more value for them as well, and a bigger incentive for them to come and make that appearance on your show because then they’re getting that extra exposure to your audience through the community.

So you’ve touched on a few reasons here already, or benefits of having the podcast. Like you said, you can put that info out there and not have to repeat it, you know, and it’s a starting point for your audience. When you think back to when you first started the podcast, do you remember any of the reasons or goals at that point?

Like what were you hoping it would accomplish for you by starting that podcast?

I didn’t think of it too much. Because. One, I didn’t know any, anything really, how to make a podcast and it wasn’t, podcasting wasn’t such a big deal as it is right now, and I didn’t have the pressure. I still had my, you know, my business and so I didn’t have the pressure. It was like, oh, I gotta monetize this.

Podcast right now. , and in the the beginning you’re getting used to, how do I ask questions? How do I make it intriguing? So you start with people you know, and friends and, and yeah, interview people, which just kind of doesn’t matter. And it gives you your training wheels and you sort of practice. It gives you content. I think I was doing three. Recordings more or less per week, three or four. Sometimes, you know, a bit more. If I just be, and it was purely out of interest. It wasn’t because I gotta grow this podcast and it has to start monetizing. It. Didn’t have that pressure at the time. It was an add-on to my business, but now it’s becoming. The bread and butter of the business because then you can, you can sell advertising space, you can have sponsored episodes. When you have the audience, you have this platform. And so, they didn’t have this grant plan. In fact, I started it thinking, let’s just see where it goes.

If I lose interest, I’m just. Gonna let it go. And I didn’t lose interest and I kept going. And obviously it was, people wanted to hear more. And then when you got into the menopause space, it’s like there was so little information. So I had reached a real good niche there was not enough information out there, so I was one of the few sharing the information and, and that was, that was a bonus ’cause, and then you, you grow more, much more quickly. So that was, that was very helpful.

When you started that, did you have much of a following at that point? ’cause you had had the business for a while before the podcast. How did that look in terms of your audience or community size at that point before you started it?

Well before I started, yeah, I had, I had a decent community, but. it was a matter of how do you mon monetize them. It’s always the question, how do you convert them into paying customers of what? Right. And, and all I had was affiliations. Maybe I talk about a product or something, but, or my own products.

Right. My own books or my own programs. but it wasn’t so big and it’s still not so big. I’m working on it now. I mean, it’s all relative. Some people are like, oh, you’re so big. And then I look at other people much bigger than me going, wait, I have a lot of room. To grow here, so I think it was

I had enough to just scrape by, but I still. Was in the red in terms of, in, I would call it, investing in my business. Then the podcast just, it kept growing and growing and I saw that there was a demand. So you, it motivates you to keep going. And then when you get messages, you hear from people sending you emails or they comment on YouTube ’cause you post the video there, or emails.

appreciate it and they want it. It, it is motivating. Oh, okay. I really need to keep going. Even if it’s just. One or two, ’cause sometimes you feel really alone when you’re podcasting who’s listening out there. You appreciate the feedback when it comes.

So, so I would say, no, it wasn’t you know, it wasn’t like I had this huge following and, and that helped me, you know, convert those people to listeners. Not at all.

Well, I’m glad you mentioned that motivation aspect, because that’s a , good thing to touch on because if you look at the stats, so many people that start the podcast, they just stop, and that’s a big reason why is. Even maybe a few months in, they’re just thinking, there’s no one really listening here.

I don’t know if it’s worth it. And if you’re able to move past that point and stay with it, you can get the types of results that you are talking about here. Now, did you have those moments at all? Because you said right off the bat you were pretty interested in all these conversations, but did you have any moment where you felt like uh, I might just quit this, or I’m too busy it’s not working, or was it all good all the time?

For me, it was pretty good. I, I, I could talk about menopause all the time. I’m just, it’s my interest. I’m passionate about it. If I just sat there and with a microphone by myself, be talking about it, and there is so much to learn. So I think when you are choosing a, a topic or a podcast niche, it’s gotta be something you are happy to talk about it every single day with anybody and that you’ll never run out of content. It, it, or, you know, science always evolves or menopause, you know, information. It continually evolves. There’s always controversy and debate. And

Mm-hmm.

so I would have one guest say, HRT is good and or hormone therapy is good.

The other one says it’s bad. And so then the people who are listening like, oh my God, so. What do we do? You know, because I like, I like to bring, I mean, I don’t have an agenda really. I just like to bring both sides of the story of people. Maybe they’ll not agree. And sometimes I do round tables and I bring, I’m like, okay, like we’re all confused now.

So now we’re gonna put you guys in the same room because I’m not the doctor here, but you guys can. Can duke it out. So that’s also another fun thing to do with the podcast. But I have to say no, one because it wasn’t like I have to make money today on the podcast. And two is, is a passion of mine. So I could talk about it all the time.

And I, and I am a nomad, so it was easy as long as I had microphone and, wifi, can do this anywhere. I didn’t need to have the perfect mind. I didn’t have a mic in the beginning. I didn’t have lamp, I didn’t have anything. I would love to have a podcast studio and look all professional. But I don’t. And, but that hasn’t stopped me. Maybe one day I, I will have to take it next level, but you go things bit by bit and then you add onto it. ’cause unless you have a ton of money and you can go straight.

To the chase, but if you don’t, then you’ll get your mic one day or you get your lights and you’ll get your headphones and you’ll get the things that you need and upgrade your computer. And would say for me it was like that, it was bit by bit. I, I just kept adding on and I learned from other podcast hosts and said, what are you do?

How, what mic are you using? Or what headphones are you using? And where can I get better sound quality? And, and now I’m thinking, should I move from Zoom into Riverside it’s like a house. You never, you never stop. Just keep building on it.

Yes, it’s always good to improve and have a minimum level of quality as well, but I would say there’s some things that once you get to a certain point, it’s not really going to help that much more. Like your audio quality, for example, right now is perfectly acceptable. If you were to go spend $5,000 on a mic, it’s not gonna make any difference

there’s so many other things you could think about. Something that you mentioned is the idea of varying viewpoints. So you don’t have a single side or a bias. You’re just there to try to learn and get even differing viewpoints on. And then you mentioned the round tables to try to sort those thoughts out.

Let’s talk about that a bit. How does it feel for you as you, your audience, has grown and grown and come to see you as an authority and look to you for advice? Because yeah, if they’re hearing, let’s, let’s call it conflicting info from the same podcast, even then. I assume they’re looking at you to say, Hey, help us sort this out, and what’s the right answer here?

How has that affected you over the years, like being this person that they come to and trust, do you feel a responsibility there in terms of how you put things out there? What does that look like? I.

Yeah, you do feel the weight as, as you grow bigger and you know people are listening and they send you information and you feel a responsibility for sure. My whole jam is to help women navigate all the confusion because they will hear one thing

Mm-hmm.

another one from my guests, another one from their doctor, and another one from their girlfriend.

And they’re like, what do I do? So, so I’m here to help them navigate not and to say, don’t listen to me. Right. There’s, so that’s my position is, is there’s gonna get all this thing, you have to listen to you and I teach them how to, how to dial into their own intuition and, and, and figure things out themselves.

That’s what biohacking is all about. ’cause I’m all about biohacking, menopause. That means you’re doing your own self experimentation and , you advocate for yourself and you keep learning whether you know the. Through a podcast or a book or whatever. But we do have these opportunities to give our opinion through one podcast, , intro.

’cause sometimes when I may not fully agree, or I may have my opinion on it, that I feel a bit stronger in the intro, I can say, look, I. This person’s gonna say this, and I personally think, you know, you need to do that. You do what you want. But I get a chance to do that in the intro. And the other thing that’s very powerful, and I think for anybody who needs to show that they’re an authority in whatever it is that they’re doing, is that you have solo episodes. And solo episodes gives a person a chance to, to hear what, what you think, how am I gonna sort through this information? Or, I really like Zora’s guests. They may say different things, but I wanna know what, what does she do and how does she navigate this? And what is. Her opinion on that. So you have your solo episodes and when I was starting to work with podcast agents who now sell space and advertising, I was told you need to really start doing more solo episodes.

 That. Shows your authority, at least what you know, or people say it’s bunch of b, she does nothing.

Whatever it is they wanna decide, but they get a chance to listen to you and what you think.

Right.

And then it also increases your podcast listening rate the downloads because you have two chances to, to download. So I noticed my, my downloads increased when I added a second episode per week.

Okay, great. Yeah, that’s great to know. Great strategy as well to do those solo episodes. ’cause people do want to hear from you and like you’re saying, that’s. That’s part of why you’re there is there’s too much information. I don’t know what to decide, but what does Zora think? ’cause I trust her. Right. With, great power comes great responsibility. So anyone in this space, specifically health and wellness, you know, they’re trying to grow that audience, but there does come that responsibility with it so let’s talk a bit more business

we know that the podcast has become a pretty big part of your marketing funnel and getting new leads. Is that, your biggest source of leads right now, or are they coming from other places? Tell us a bit about what you even know about where you, your new leads are coming from. for now, maybe they’re falling on Instagram or they’re finding the podcast. Just anyone that comes into your world, let’s say for the first time.

I would say the best conversion is from your, your podcast episodes that you are talking about some product. But for me, when, when we make a partnership with a product and we’re very careful about least I am, and my, our team is, is how we curate because people, have trust. I don’t ever wanna lose that trust.

You don’t just make a deal.

Hmm.

with anyone who’s ready to throw money at you. And, and I know they’re podcasters that do, but I don’t. If you’ve been listening to a podcast host for a while, you, you kind of, you either trust ’em or you don’t trust them.

and I have to say my, my audience is, is very vulnerable. A woman going through menopause is feeling really bad, very high pain points, so you can sell her anything. And I, I, I don’t ever wanna abuse that. And so I’m very careful about what, what I choose to share.

Okay. So yes, in addition to having your funnel where people can come and eventually be a customer of yours with your own products and programs, you are getting sponsorship type money for your episodes as well, whether it’s an appearance or products, that sort of thing.

Yeah, if it’s my own product, which are very, I have very few of my own. There’s, and these are digital products. I don’t

Yeah.

or that other, well, there are plenty of podcast shows who do wind up creating their own supplement or on their own products, and that’s their opportunity That can sell at every time.

In the midroll, the midroll of the podcast, if it’s empty and no one’s paid for that space, I put my own, product, which would be usually the, the membership program. And so I kind of slip in saying, Hey, you know, if you listen so far, do you like our guest? I. Would you like to meet our guest, live in

Mm.

on a q and a?

Well then join the biohacking membership menopause Membership Group. And it’s a chance for me to advertise and sell my own thing. And it, you know, it, it, it’s, it’s to do it under 40 seconds because by the time the person realizes an advertisement, then they have a time to like, like leave or stop or fast forward.

Right.

you know, one of the, the techniques is try to get it. Short, it’s not easy, especially if you’re, if you’re you know, have a lot to say about certain things.

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Where are you meeting your guests? Mostly anyway. Obviously some of them are coming through those official channels to, to do a sponsorship, but are you still organically meeting people or taking pitches? What is that like for you these days? I.

Yeah. Yeah. Most, most of my guests are either, I curate them, I, I go after them and I say, I really want this person on my podcast. So usually that’s, where I like it to be, because I want most of my information to be from really great guests. Then there are podcast exchanges. So to grow my podcast, I need to get on other people’s podcasts, and they know that too.

Mm-hmm.

will do a podcast exchange, and that’s, and you have to filter through those people, make sure that they have. Good information and that you agree with what they’re saying. ’cause you know, just because you’re on their podcast or their, their podcast may be two people listening. You know, you don’t really, really know.

Mm-hmm.

can’t, but you can go and look through and how many episodes they’ve had and, and, and try to see where they’re at, if it’s worth your time or not worth your time. The rest are pitches. Yeah, people, I get pitches all the time, and so you, most of them are nos, but once in a while you, you see somebody be quite interesting and if you can get a podcast exchange out of it, great.

If not, maybe you can ask for their mailing list. How can you share this episode because. I have a team, I have editors, I have VAs. I I have to pay for every episode, and it’s not cheap. And then guests wants to come on for free, well, they better be really, really good.

So, so you need to curate your, your guests, and I think people who listen don’t realize the cost that goes into creating a podcast. so then You, if somebody pitches me a guest and then what I do is a pre a screening call, like it’s like it looks interesting.

Let’s kind of see if we are a match, because I’ve had times where I thought we were matches and then they say something and it’s like, oh, I don’t know if they deserve to be on my platform for a free, especially,

Mm-hmm.

It’s rare that happens, but you have control. You can do whatever you want. You can decide if you wanna publish something or not. I, I generally, I, I would usually sit and reflect before I, I, you know, I won’t follow my instinct.

I don’t like what they said. I, I’m like, you know what? Doesn’t really matter. Just because I don’t like what they said. It’s okay. Maybe it will resonate with somebody else. And I still have a chance to, in my intro to say what I think.

Right.

But it depends, yeah, how much you wanna control but I, I really try to be neutral. I really try to. To, to give people a chance to, to say both sides. And people generally know after a while they know, my opinion on things, and, and it’s not my opinion. They have to listen to. It’s what’s good for them and what’s good for me. May, may not be good for them,

Mm.

So then the remaining will be some pitches and I’ll take those.

Okay. Specifically when it comes to the outreach that you mentioned and, and finding, identifying people you’d like to be on the show and making that happen, how are you going about that? Because I know a lot of people struggle these days. Maybe not at your level, but we just hear a lot about it, like they’re just, the pitches are falling on deaf ears, they’re just deleting every pitch that comes in, or Instagram puts it into the other inbox, they never see it.

How do you go about that? Is it like relationship building or is it a single message?

Oh, actually the best way is, is through relationships. If you can, I just did this yesterday and I had a friend who’s a podcast host and she had a big guest on, and I’m like, God, I’ve been trying to get that GED and my, my emails are going to deaf ears. I. She made a connecting email to me and then I’ll do the same.

I was like, okay, who do you want on my list? Like

Yep.

help you and at least make that introduction because that person who’s already spoken to you has, you have a little bit of trust and I wouldn’t recommend any Joe Schmo and so if I think it’s a good fit, then you make that introductory email.

So those are really, really important. But in terms of the pitches. I do delete a lot. I try to at least most times say, not interested or come back later, or, I don’t know. but I would say the ones that capture my attention, the ones that are very short. That have a media kit included. So if I wanted to find out more about the guests, I just click on the button or the link.

Mm-hmm.

media kits are good because it just kind of gives you a whole rundown. Then you have all the information there. was one time somebody made a pitch to me and it really worked and it was, he made a very short video, Hey Zora, and he had a sign saying, Hey, Zora, with my name on it. It built so much curiosity. , I got the, an appointment with him.  Making it a little bit personal is important, , but I think everybody’s now. Really dialed into, Hey Zora, I listened to your episode with Dr. Joe Schmoe and I really liked it. And so I think my guess would be good. That doesn’t work anymore. We all know that’s sort of very scripted but I think something very short and, with the media kit is, is good enough.

Yes, that opening line, I, I am truly impressed by the work that you’re doing. Like ev everyone is onto that now. Everyone is sending the same emails. I don’t know if it’s AI or not, but yeah, we just, anything like that we just pick up on one thing that I, I just wanted to highlight there that you mentioned that I think is a great idea is that media kit, so this is the perspective of you reviewing pitches.

’cause I get some of these too, where they’re just telling me a name of someone. It’s, it’s. Not even this person. It’s like someone on their behalf is saying Zora will be a great fit for your podcast, but there’s no link, no website. I just don’t know who this person is. How do you expect me to accept that pitch?

Who are you?

Yeah, we need to investigate a little bit and see, who that person is or, or you can feel if they have interesting information or would be a good match. And we go, oh, wow, I’ve, I’ve never done a podcast on menopause. Okay. And they’ll see, oh, it’s biohacking menopause, or I’ve done menopause before.

But if they go in, they may find something in there about you that’s unique that they haven’t done yet on their episode. But yeah, definitely have links and media kits.

The final thing I’d like to ask you, because we are talking to a lot of newer entrepreneurs who are trying to get their businesses up and, and running to say the size of something like you have.

It can look great on here. We have a big podcast. You have a successful business, but there are always challenges, or at the very least priorities that we’re working on as entrepreneurs. What would you say for, for 2025 is a big one that you are working on? Doesn’t have to be a challenge necessarily, but something in your business.

Oh, well actually I just have jumped into a business accelerator program for social media my one goal is really to get more. People to listen to the podcast. You gotta get more downloads because for me, if as a, if, if I have an agent helping me work with me, then I can grow, they can charge more and everybody makes more when you have a bigger audience.

Right.

one is get that, but I also am working on the social media because I can, I can use that as well to funnel into the podcast listenership and, and as well as eventually also. Sell more, whatever, X, Y, and Z and charge more for whatever it is. So I think building your audience is really, really important. I think for me, I’m playing around with different platforms, but I think Instagram will be my power there and to help and is not only to help women, you know, help me, but also help women get information about menopause out there and, and get it into a digestible format. it’s gotta, it’s, there’s a whole. Strategy to doing this, and me just posting as it is, is not working. I mean, you grow, but it’s very, very, very slow. So understanding the strategy and how to create viral videos is really, really important. And at least for me right now, I’m, I’m dedicating my, my next like six months to see if I can really push it. And then also get better with the content because we also create reels from our, interviews, and I wanna get that better as well and make sure that, that we get good clips and that we have, we, we are able to format in a way that’s digestible and interesting so that people go, oh, okay, eventually I wanna go to the listen to the episode.

And that’s what we always do with every episode that we post a reel on. We have a ManyChat automated. Service that

Hmm.

okay, if you wanna hear the whole episode, not just this one clip, then comment X, y, z. So that helps with building the engagement on the reel, but it also brings people to listen to the podcast and who perhaps have never even knew you even had a podcast because it just sort of found you on Instagram.

Okay. Very interesting idea. That’s, and something people can take and, and implement right now if you’re saying that it, it improves your engagements. That’s, that’s great. And important note there too, to think about how everything is always relative, like. your idea of not working is, I think you have 35,000 followers or something like that on Instagram.

So for so many people they would think, I would love to have that many followers, but yeah, there’s always room to grow. So that’s, it’s good to hear. And yet you’re not just accepting, I’m done growing. Like there’s, there’s always room for improvement, let’s say.

Yeah, and there’s, there’s actually, it’s not so much about the, the numbers. Okay. It would be great to have a hundred thousand, but if they’re not engaged.

Mm.

anything.

Right.

you wanna say jump, they jump and you better off having a thousand followers for jump than 35,000. And like nobody’s reacting.

All right.

don’t, don’t underestimate the power of small creators. if these are real good people, organically grown, who like what you have to say, who trust you, and they’re engaged and they’re commenting and they’re sharing. The biggest thing that you want in social media is people to share. Okay, that you want

All right.

on that, and when you share, you don’t even need that many comments. Eventually they will say, so don’t look at people’s numbers and don’t look at the number of likes, and don’t look at the number of comments you wanna see, really, the engagement and how many views have been seen in that, in that reel or that video. So don’t underestimate if you, if you start out small and, and there’s always, there’s always room to grow.

Excellent insight. We’ll leave it there. You’ve been very, very helpful. I know there’s gonna be a lot of takeaways from this episode for our audience to go and implement in their businesses. So thank you so much, Zora, and we’ll have your links for Hack My Age in the show notes so people can come and take a look at everything you’re offering.

Great. Thank you so much for having me.